Working with Mangroves

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How To Place Your Newly Acquired Mangroves In Your Sump Correctly

There are several ways in which you can order your mangroves:

Seeds
Seeds with some roots
Seeds with long roots
Seeds with roots and some leaves

Here is A Real quick view at Ordering Mangroves and their Cost in an unusual Way .....

In all cases, regardless of what you have ordered, the seeds need to be treated in the same manner initially. The purpose of this document is to explain what you should do and what you will need when your seeds arrive.

Note that the seeds need to be shipped overnight although I have received some in two day service that were still fine and had not suffered from the longer transit period and being out of the water.

Some seeds will be totally green, others will be green and some black or some brownish parts. As long as the seed is not rotting, all is fine and you can proceed with the steps I will outline here.

The seeds look like the pods on the left the mangrove you see depicted here:

The pods you see (the long green seeds) are actually shown upside down. Why they are shown in that manner is odd to stay the least but I guess they fit better on the graphic that way.

The top is the root, and the bottom is the actual top of the mangrove where after a while leaves will develop.

Note that the seeds and the mangrove itself are to the same scale.

Note the characteristic shape of this seed. White mangrove seeds look more like lima beans actually, whereas these look like thick string beans. The length varies but 6 to 8 inches is not uncommon.

I have had some that were over 10 inches long and had no roots or leaves. Length is not something we are concerned with therefore. What we do want is that the seeds arrive moist and that they are not frozen. They can be cold but not frosted or frozen.

How are we going to handle the seeds when they arrive?

Just take the seeds out of the plastic bag they are in.
There is no need to clean them or rinse them.
Seperate the seeds from each other and be careful not to break the roots or the top.
Do not pay too much attention to the color of the seed. There will be some green and some brown and maybe even some black, all mixed or you may have one that is completely brown or green. The color is not important.
Some will have roots that are more or less developed depending on what you ordered.
The bottom part of the seed is typically thicker than the top part and the top part may or may not have a thinner extension (where leaves will grow)
The seeds you are getting have already been brought up to the s.g. you normally keep your tank at so you do not need to "acclimate" them (as you may read in certain documents).
This has already been done for you.
The seeds need to be half in the water and half out of the water. How are we going to achieve this?
What you will need is styrofoam.
The lid of a fish box or any other piece of styrofoam will do.
The size you need depends on how many seeds you have.
Make holes through the styro using a pencil and maybe a knife so you can make the holes a little larger but do not make them too large (the seeds will be stuck through and need to remain held in place.
When you have made sufficient holes and spaced them equidistantly, insert your seed from the bottom, meaning push the thinner end through the hole from below and push up till the seed remains in place.
The roots will now be at the bottom and the top of the seed comes through the styro and is what you are looking at.
Once all your seeds are placed in the same manner in the styro, float the piece of styro with the seeds in it, on the water of your sump. It does not matter where really.
The roots will now be in the water and so will part of the seed.
You have now introduced your seeds correctly to the sump.

For your seeds to grow and for them to start developing more roots and some leaves (this can take several weeks) you will need to put some light over them.

I use a plant light (from Home Depot or similar store) and a fixture that you can clip on to the side of the sump (the ones I use are aluminum and have a metal clip that is protected by a rubberized material - I bought them at Home Depot too). The reflector is not important. Mine are like half a football with a place to screw the bulb (incandescent) in.

Lights or bulbs designated as plant bulbs are fine and 40 watts is all you need.

Clip the lamp holder (sort of a workshop type fixture - mine cost around $10.00) on the side of the sump where you styro and seeds are and plug the cord in so you have light over the mangrove seeds. The light should be on the same side of the sump as where your seeds are. Maintain about a one foot to 18 inches distance between the light and the top of the seeds.

Run the lights 12 hours per day. Use about the same photoperiod as you do for your tank. You can run the lights for longer if you wish but it appears that this is not necessary.

If your seed has leaves, be careful when you pass it through the hole not to break them off. At this point there were very few with leaves sold. If you do have some with leaves, make a sidecut through the styrofoam so you can insert the seed from the side and not through the bottom (doing so will not damage the leaves)

If you wish to speed up the growth of your seeds you can dose some plant fertilizer to the tank (I use an iron supplement and dose to 0.05 ppm). A macro-algae fertilizer is probably a good supplement to use but a plain iron supplement will do just as well.

After a week, or more, you will start to see that a slight growth occurs on the top of the see, the beginning of a leaf or the beginning of a new leaf if you already have one. How fast your mangroves will grow cannot be predicted. A lot has to do with the seed itself. Seed genetics kind of regulate what goes on but, if you make the environmnent conducive to growth, the seeds grow leaves and roots and clean the water in the process, as to grow they remove the nutrients they need from the water. Some are recycled and added back and improve your water quality.

Some hobbyist (myself included) have and run aquariums with mangroves and do not use a skimmer on such tanks. At this stage though I recommend that you do not discontinue your skimmer's operation. More details in later installments.

Mangroves as used for aquariums will not get as large as what you think (what you sometimes see in movies or documentaries). They will remain small and you will make them stay small by regularly removing leaves once they start to develop them. Always leave at least one leaf though. Never pinch them all off

This is your basis for starting with your seeds. What you are really interested in from an aquarium standpoint is the roots as they are the ones that uptake the nutrients out of the water and recycle them and purify the water and maintain it in better condition

At some point the roots become longer and thicker (this can take weeks or months depending on how much root structure there was when you got the seeds.

At some point down the line you will probably want to go one step further and that is to plant the seeds. I will deal with this in the second part of this article which I will add in a few days.

Right now all those who have seeds from us (and we still have some left and a new batch is coming in), do not yet need to plant them.

They will be planted in sand (we call it siltsand) which is totally different than the mud you may have heard about that is used in another system (Leng Sy method with macro algae). These are two totally different methods.

So to recap:

Insert the seeds in a piece of flat styrofoam
Float this on the water of your sump
Place a 40 watt light over them
Run the light for 12 hours a day
Add some iron supplement if you wish (it is a good idea to do so)
Let the roots grow and let leaves start to grow as well
When more than two leaves are present, pinch all of them off except one
Do not damage the green thin growth that will come out of the top of the seed as that is a new leaf (well the beginning of one)
Be patient and let the mangroves clean up your water. You will be surprised at how efficiently they reduce nitrate and phosphate and recycle organic materials and improve the water quality.

There is, of course much more to be said about mangroves and you may wish to read the many articles in our SW Library and in the Latest Site Changes section of our web site too.

I will add more information as time goes on and complement this so you know more about mangroves and what to do and how to maximize their water purification ability.

Should a mangrove die off, and some do of course, you should remove it from your sump but do not throw it away. I will deal with this in the next issue. Keep an eye on announcements about more info on mangroves.

Should you have any question at all, or wish to ""order"" mangroves, Email Me and I will be glad to Answer Your Questions.

The above introduces you to what to do with your seeds. If for some reason this is not clear or you have questions, use the email link above or ICQ me if you see me on line. Email is better though.

Mangroves will, in my experience, improve your water quality a good deal so I strongly recommend them.

You will soon find out yourself!

Furhter Information on Mangroves

This second update on mangroves deals mostly with answers to Questions received and, believe me, there were many many. Mangroves seem to, indeed, have captured a lot of interest amongst reefkeepers, and even FO (fish-only) tank owners want more information (yes you can use mangroves on FO tanks also).

Some hobbyists have pointed out that they already own fluorescent fixtures and are wondering if these can be used. The answer is of course: yes. By all means. Add a low Kelvin degree bulb or two (depending on your fixture) and you will be fine. What you are looking for is Plant or Grow lights or FL tubes with a K degree rating of around 3300 (as that includes a lot of red and yellow which is excellent for plant and mangrove growth).

The lowest amount of plant light you want to use is 20 watts. 40 watts for 12 hours a day is better.

How much iron should you have in the tank? 0.05/0.07 ppm seems to be fine but even a little lower than that will help the mangroves develop a root structure faster.

Is Carbon dioxide addition necessary? No it is not. There is enough in the water for the mangroves to uptake (especially during the night).

Should I run my light on a reverse cycle? No. Run them during the day or, expressed in a clearer manner, during the same time you run your tank lights.

Should I add anything else to the water: B-12 is a good plant fertilizer as well. If you add 100 mcg (micrograms) per day of a standard vitamin bottle you will enhance growth even further. You may wish to do this in the beginning but when your mangroves are growing well this is no longer necessary. They should find plenty of food sources in the tank's water.

What about Molybdenum? Mb is presentin KSM so if you add that product from TAD/TAT you are providing it and that will help the mangroves as well.

Some leaves seem to get brownish around the edges, what do I do? Nothing until there is another leaf unless that one turns totally brown in which case you have insufficient amounts of nutrients in the water (add a little iron and you should be ok).

Why do I need mangroves at all if I already have live sand and live rock? Good question indeed! To clean up the water further and recycle nutrients. Phosphates and nitrates will remain low and your water quality will be improved. You get purer water because the mangroves are excellent for removing nutrients and other elements (e.g. trace metals)

How many mangroves do I really need? 1 per 10 to 15 gallons is a good average to go by. You can put more in your sump or even tank, but it does not appear to be necessary. I will explain this further in the next update.

Do I need "mud" or "sand" or "SiltSand"? Actually it really depends on how you set your mangroves up. After a while for nutrient recycling it is better to place them in either real mangrove mud (and this is "not" the same mud as used in the Leng Sy system) or in "SiltSand" which is a mixture of fine and coarser live sand. For the first few months though that is really not necessary.

If you wish to do so you can of course but unless the roots are getting real large there is in my experience no need to do so.

I have tanks set up of all three kinds and all mangroves do just fine.

Will my mangroves grow too large? No, they will not. The roots get larger but you can alwasy trim those back if need be. The seed itself can be kept small by nipping off the leaves (always leave at least one). Never pinch all the leaves off.

This will keep the mangrove to 8 to 10 inches. If you feel like it you can let it grow larger but it is not necessary for water purification. I have one that has 16 leaves and is about one foot tall and looks real nice and sits in a 30 gallon sump installed on a 75 gallon tank. It is not yet in mud or sand and has a rather large root structure. I am letting it grow to see how large it will actually become in aquarium conditions as opposed to in nature. It has taken over 9 months to get it that large and I "planted" it in styro shortly after we arrived in Atlanta in early April of 1997.

What will happen to my skimmer when I use mangroves in my tank? Actually not much in the beginning but as the mangroves develop a more elaborate root structure and really start to clean up the water you will have to re-adjust the skimmer or it will not remove anything. If you use enough mangroves the skimmer will eventually become redundant. Yes, that is what I said: you will no longer need it. This will however not happen for some time (several months depending on the load in the tank and the number of mangroves you use - the more you have the sooner this will happen). This is a new twist to water filtration of course.

I have two smaller systems running without skimmers now. I had one and have removed the skimmer from another one and have no outbreaks of algae or cyanobacteria, no yellowing of the water and nothing that is typically associated with skimmers that are not efficient or not using one at all. The mangroves seem to take over the cleaning very efficiently. This can save those who set up new tanks or additional tanks quite a bit of money indeed!

Replies to more questions in update 3. If you have questions please send them to me at athiel@bellsouth.net

"More" Answers To Yet "More" Questions

Do mangroves remove iodine from the water: yes but to a minor degree. They do not require iodine for growth but, since plants absorb elements from the water and since iodine will be present (especially in LPS and SPS coral tanks as opposed to FO tanks), some will be removed. All you really need to do is check your levels and adjust the amount of iodine you add to your tank, if necessary. Note that I said if necessary as you may not have to do so.

Because the water quality that is obtained using mangroves appears to be better (at least based on standard tests) than with a skimmer, there is one really interesting test to run: a BOD test.

What this entails is taking two water samples and testing the first one immediately for dissolved oxygen, storing the second one in the dark for 48 hours and then testing it for dissolved oxygen, and noting the difference.

This test needs to be conducted on a tank with a skimmer and no mangroves, and then on a tank without a skimmer but in which mangroves have been present for a few days.

If my contentions and findings are correct then the difference between the two measurements should be smaller when the mangroves are used. I have not been able to perform that test because of my recent move.

I should have the results of this test though by the time I update this document again. My hunch is that they will confirm what I suspect mainly because all other water quality parameters tested so far as better as well. By inference is the water is purer the organic load has to be lower and so the difference between the two tests will be low.

Some hobbyists have asked about lighting. Again, 40 watts of a plant type light is just fine. It can be either incandescent or fluorescent. Either is fine. Keep the top of the mangrove about 12 inches away from the light source. If they are too close the leaves will burn and turn brown.

A question that has come up quite a few times is whether or not the mud is necessary. By mud I mean the mangrove mud. Do not confuse this,please, with the Miracle Mud used in the Leng Sy System as they are totally different.

The mud we sell and use is mud in which mangroves actually grow and varies in color depending on where it is collected. It goes from red to real dark and nearly black.

In the beginning, when you first install your mangroves, you should float them as explained earlier in this document. As roots grow, and expand, and become more knotty you may wish to consider rooting them in the mud we sell for them.

Remember though that when you do so you need to ensure that the tops are still out of the water. This may require that the container used to house the mud be lifted off the bottom off the sump.

The amount needed depends on the number of mangroves you have. It is a good idea to order about two pound per mangrove so that they can be "planted" firmly. Till the roots embed themselves you will need to suppor them or they will fall over.

What I have done is used strip of styro foam wedged across the narrow sides of the sump and rested the mangroves against them. The strips are wedged against the longer panes of glass and hold the mangroves in place. Once the root structure expands these can be taken away.

Note that the 2 pounds per mangrove is just an estimate. If you have large number of them (say 7 or 8) you may only need about 1.5 lbs per mangrove.

If you have questions about this just email me and I will be glad to help you.

The thickness of the mud should be between 1.5 and 2 inches. You should use mangrove mud or SiltSand (tm). Both are the substrates that the mangroves grow in (depending on where they come from).

If you order mangroves I will send you the right substrate even if you order the wrong one, as I know where the mangroves I send you came from and what they need.

Can you start with mud immediately? Yes you can but it is not necesary. On the other hand it will not affect the way your mangroves clean the water so the choice is entirely yours. Just realize that at some point you will need the mud or the SiltSand (tm).

So far we have covered most of what you need to know to use mangroves effectively and how to place them in your sump. One area remains to be explained: how to use them if you do not have a sump and I will do so in the next installment.

Demistifying some Misconceptions

It would appear from feedback I have received that mistakes have been made when installing mangroves (and we have replaced them free of charge, excluding shipping). Let's take this update to clarify things somewhat further :

If the heat reaching the portion of the mangroves that is out of the water is too high, the mangrove will wither and shrivel, and loose its leaves. It may or may not die but it is not performing as it should of course.
If some leaves turn brown, pinch them off just as you do with house plants. They will eventually grow back. This takes time. Mangroves grow real slowly. Sometimes weeks or even more go by before you see new leaves. Then again, it is not the leaves you are interested in but the root structure (which develops slowly too).
Consider that you star to see the real benefit of the mangroves after about 3 or so months. You may see some benefits sooner but, in general, to gauge what is happening a few months is a good timeframe to go by. Patience is definitely needed. The results will happen but not instantaneously and not in a few days. I think some may have misunderstood that.
If your mangrove has no leaves, do not worry. Eventually they will grow. What you first will see is a fine light green growth coming out at the top. This eventually develops into a leaf. The roots develop slowly too but they do grow and become more profuse.
If no roots are present, but knobs are, roots will eventually appear. Weeks can however go by before that happens
If you have bought the ones with roots, you have mangroves that are starting to uptake nutrients immediately, or they would not survive. Do they grow faster because they are uptaking nutrients? Not really. To some extent that is good as you do not really want several foot high mangroves in your sump either. You want to keep them small by regularly pinching the leaves off when they appear.
I have mangroves that I purposely let grow and they are over 2.5 feet tall and have large leaves. That is not what you want to do though. I did it as an experiment just to determine whether it could actually be done and it can.

More Information ....

Some have reported yellowing of their water after placing mangroves in their sump or tank. What happens is that for a certain amount of time until the mangroves really start to uptake nutrients you may indeed see this happen especially if your skimmer goes flat. This is not yellowing material from the mangroves themselves though, but albumin that is produced by the breakdown or organic matter in the tank.

Since the mangroves are not yet taking it up and since your skimmer may not be removing it or may not be removing it as efficiently, you may indeed see some yellowing. Once the mangroves kick in though this will disappear in a matter of days. The key again here is that patience is needed. Mangroves are added but they do not start to operate at maximum efficiency right away. You can, however, convince yourself that they do by reading the document that I placed our site that recaps data taken over a one year period of time in aquariums where mangroves where running.

If you wish to access it, click Here for further details and all the tables or results over 13 months of testing 6 tanks (3 controls without mangroves and 3 with mangroves). There are six tables of listings of measurements for you to look at and evaluate. I have listed far fewer numbers than I really have but the ones listed make the trend of what happens in aquariums with mangroves real clear.

You will see 5 principal results:

The Nutrients go down and are lower faster than in the Control tanks. This applies to phosphates and nitrates but also to silicates.
Oxygen levels go up faster.
BOD, or biological oxygen demand, is far lower in tanks with mangroves than in tanks where there are none indicating that the mangroves uptake more of the organic material than the skimmers removed in the other tanks.
Oxygen levels stabilize and are generally higher.
This all takes time. It does not happen in a few weeks.

Feed water from the "tank" to the mangroves not water from the skimmer, and do not run ozone in that sump or you will damage the root system of the mangroves.

If the parts that are above the water level seem to dry out and turn brown, they may be receiving too much heat from the light source you are using. If when placing your hand close to the mangrove seed you can feel the heat from the light source, the light is too close and you will need to get it further away.

Sunlight does mangroves a lot of good so if you have seeds that do not seem to be doing all that well, place them in a shallow tray with SW from your aquarium and place them in the sun or by a window in the sunlight. If you place them outside make sure the temperature of the water does not drop too much. This is especial helpful in the beginning when you have just received your seeds and they need a growth boost.

Yellowing occurs but is not really the result of having mangroves in the tank. Organic matter in the aquarium decays and forms yellowing matter (also called Gilvin). At first the mangroves may not remove it but after a while they will. If on top of that your skimmer is not operating at full force because of the nutrient depletion by the mangroves, it may not remove as much organic matter as it normally does. Note though that once the mangrove really start performing what they do best your overall water quality will be better than what you now have providing you have enough of them in the tank. This can be seen in the document where I listed all the testing results.

If you decide to use mangrove mud you will need about 1.5 pounds per mangrove.

If you have any questions, please Email Me.